Forum topic: New sponsor system

Reduce number of sponsor slots
Not a huge fan of this idea but would rather see sponsor slots unlock in a few different ways.

Facilities - currently have Staff building for more staff and Admin points, Design facility (designer points) and R&D facility (mechanical points) but nothing for Commercial so adding an module for Commercial would be a nice addition. Based on the level of Facility could have the sponsorship locked

or

Commercial Staff - currently doesn't make much sense to have one or two commercial staff members so having sponsorship locked to the amount of commercial staff ranging from 1-5 staff members depending on the strength of the staff member. Similar to the coaches system where they can have X amount of drivers trained under them only. A commercial manager can only hand so many sponsorship clients before they need more assistance.

Create a specialization for an extra section X (tbd, not 1 or 2) slot. Or do this by skills of commercials?
Yes, Agreed as mentioned above under the commercial staff suggestion each staff member can handle max 3? sponsorship meaning currently you would need five staff members to get all 15 sponsorship slots filled but since you are talking about reducing sponsor slot then Junior commercials should have further limits say 1-2? sponsors that they can handle.

Add in the fact that handling sponsors means:
A. Improving/maintaining relationship with sponsor
B. Looking for Deal
C. Negotiation

This mean assigning work loads correctly between the commercial staff members as they have limited slots for Handling Sponsors, forcing more commercial staff members to be hired and stronger Facility to be able to handle more sponsors.

* Remove sponsor relations since it's not maintainable. To be replaced by a general sponsor happiness stat. There will be 3-5 type of sponsor stats, so that sponsors can fit into a certain type of company type. Ranging from Classy (Mercedes, McLaren, Ferrari), to youthful and rebellious (Red Bull, HAAS, ...). This will allow us to make more choices on how to position your team marketing wise, and will make that interesting in regards to which sponsors are interested. Moving from one type to the other will cost commercial points and will take some time.

Commercial focus or range should be determined based on current Reputation of the team as recent, permanent gives clear impression to sponsorship around team strength and add in image ranking as these should play a larger role determine how our teams are perceived to the outside world; Take Ricciardo versus Schumacher type perception. Classy I am not sure would sign with Ricciardo while fun & youthful wouldn't sign with Schumacher. So by changing the way we want the team to be perceived will determine the marketing position of the team along with results/ reputation. Can and should also add questions/ events during either "negotiations" or "Looking for deal" as mini events that help determine our marketability for the sponsors. So to sum it up: Reputation, Image & Question determines the commercial focus/range.

*After thought could move to commercial based system similar to suppliers with Progression with question being asked at 30%, 60% & 90% of the progression to determine different aspect of the contract with the sponsor so it gives a feel of negotiations.
30% - finding out interest levels (Class, Wealth, negotiability & Sponsorship level)
60% - determine contractual agreement (seasons, Weekly fee & Bonuses)
90% - Finer detail or fine print (4 Maximum missed races, Exclusive sponsor & Objectives)

*(A) making this easier can just copy the driver negotiation page but make it for the sponsors but also have progression as mentioned above similar to suppliers at 30%, 60% & 90% so that means:
30% Basic information (Location (5 - 1 Star) = Job type) (Weekly fee = Salary) (Contract length = Contract length) (Placement = Role) (Minimum number of races = Minimum number of races)
60% Bonuses - Stays the same but determine what they are paying you rather then you paying a driver/staff member
90% Clauses & Objectives - Clauses can also stay the same with addition of Exclusive sponsor & objectives

* Home race bonuses might be interesting add for team & sponsors but I don't think it would work unless expanding the countries & races per season we visit.

* this would make coding easier as most of the coding would already be written but need just switched from Staff to Sponsors. Maybe even add staff members to the new system with 30%, 60% & 90% discussion as you remove X, Y & Z team until the final contract is signed with staff member. Off topic again!! LOL!!

* Drivers get a marketability stat which is an extra influence into a certain company type that is mentioned above
Yes, and could also have them bring an extra sponsorship slot to the team or two to bring in extra sponsorship via pay driver system. How you determine which drivers bring sponsorship with them I am not sure at the moment of writing this but it would need to be based around marketability, Charisma, Ambition & Experience

If Ambition is high and Experience is low = Sponsorship slot(s) as experience increase then sponsorship slots decrease/removed

Marketability & Charisma are basically the same thing so not sure if they are needed or how they would effect this aspect; Maybe as someone else above mentioned an overall team score ( as mentioned above: Professionalism, Charisma, Drivers Reputation = Marketability score)

The team overall score would be based around as mentioned above Reputation, Image & Team members Marketability (Drivers & Staff) The overall team score would equal Class based on the teams Marketability score in which the team is perceived, from Classy, Youthful etc...

Sponsors will be more based on bonuses and not necessarily a fixed amount that is paid out.
Agreed and already touched on this see *(A) above. Move sponsorship agreement to season based will be required from weekly based system that I am sure most don't sign anyways.

A minimum requirement of certain objectives or the agreement is cancelled?
Agreed but also disagree as the current objectives are unrealistic or too simple so the objectives would need to be part of the negotiation aspect of the sponsorship agreement and could be the stumbling aspect to signing the agreement as they might ask for something your team simple cannot due and you are unable to negotiate them off of that agreement.

* Objective I don't think is the right wording here but more like season based clauses or simply Clauses

Clauses should be based around a few difference aspects but should be season based for now:
- Team Results (Missed races,Top 10 Championship standings, Top 5 Championship Standings, Top 3 Championship Standings, X Podiums, X Win(s), & Championship(s)(Drivers or Teams)
- relegation
- Marketability (decrease)
- Reputation (decrease)
- Image (decrease)

Sponsors that go bankrupt or don't pay.
Not sure this would go over well in the community as whole as the clauses & objectives I think could cause enough chaos; if we are not meeting them or being too aggressive in negotiation with clauses and objectives.

If you are going to look at implementing this change it would need to be key indicators that the sponsor is risky and may not meet the demands of the contract. * Actually already in the game the more that i think about it as the star represent the sponsors wealth and risk levels of not being able to meet sponsorships demands so 1 star & 2 Star wealth teams are more likely not to make payments, payments on time & Bankrupt (non Payments) so maybe wealth doesn't determine the sponsors wealth but more risk/security:

5 Stars = Very secure
4 Stars = Secure
3 Star = Slight risk (payments my not be on-time)
2 Star = Risky (Missed payments, Payments not on time)
1 Star = Very Risky (Missed, Not on time & Non payments)

Factors that can improve a sponsorship balance:
- Teams marketability increased = points gained by sponsors
- Race Objectives meet = points gained by sponsor

So as the team Marketability increase or decrease it has effects positive & Negatively on the sponsors as well as objectives being meet as the strength the position of the sponsorship agreement.

Each star will need to be represented by a number and every objective adds a set increase to that number so that you cannot take a 1 star sponsor and in one season make them an 5 star sponsor simply by meeting all the objectives. It should increase but increase in a slow predictable manner by increasing marketability and meeting objectives.

So if we have a star = 20pts meaning
80-100pts = 5 Star
60-80 = 4 Star
40-60 = 3 Star
20-40 = 2 Star
0-20 = 1 Star

So objective listed below would score points towards reducing the risk/ increase worth of the sponsor as you increase the image of the sponsor making the marketing more effective: Negative points would also be triggered based on missing the objective below allowing for each race to be important and triggering Missed payments, Late payments & Non Payments from the sponsors based on where they are overall points wise above table.

Race based
Missed race = -10pts = 100pts or 5 stars per season
DNF = -5pts = -50pts or -2.5 Stars per season
Outside Top 10 = -1pts = -10pts or -0.5 Stars per season
Top 10 = +1pts = 10pts or 0.5 Stars per season
Top 5 = +2pts = 20pts or 1 star per season
Podium(s) = +3pts = 30pts or 1.5 stars per season
Win(s)= +5pts = 50pts or 2.5 stars per season

End of Season Based
Championship Standings Top 10 = 1pts
Championship Standing 9th = 2pts
Championship Standing 8th = 3pts
Championship Standing 7th = 4pts
Championship Standing 6th = 6pts
Championship Standings Top 5 = 8pts
Championship Standing 4th = 10pts
Championship Standing 3rd = 15pts
Championship Standing 2nd = 18pts
Championship(s) = 20pts

These might need an % factor based on the division each team/sponsor is actually active as Division 1 should have more weight then division 2 or 3 etc.... Maybe 25% reduction per division under Division 1 so a Championship win in Division 2 is worth 15pts rather then 20pts and Division 3 would be worth 11.25pts. This would slow the raise of sponsorship risk further as they are only being marketed in lower tier division so not getting as much exposure.

Remove fans price and replace by merchandise or something.
Never been a huge fan of games that had merchandise in them but understand why as it was always based around an unlock system to give the team more income due to increase cost throughout the game. This isn't the case with Pitwall as we simple have too much money so the finical aspect of the game needs to be balanced.

But if we are going to add merchandise it needs to be tied to either a module or to the HQ as most merchandise system have at least 5 tiers to be unlocked; which matches with the HQ Building in the game already.

Objects that could be under the different tiers:
Poster
Pennants
stickers
cups
key chains
Shirts
hats
Die-cast
Sweat shirts
Umbrellas
Bags (Backpack or sports bags)
Jacket

Thanks for the feedback all (lots to process in the back of my mind Robert ). I'll come up with a draft of something and post it here soon.

I love those ideas !

*Reduce (half?) the number of sponsors, hide them by default from teams and get commercial managers to come up with possible deals. This is similar to how it was in PW1.

But, I wanted to hear your thoughts on the sponsorship system. What do you think would be a fun, competitive system?

Do it man, that's lit, just make it possible to everyone seing all sponsors (number, deals, requirements ?) at any moment even if it's the commercial that comes with offers. Nobody wants conspiracy duh

* Reduce number of sponsor slots - Perfect, only 1 spot per section like I do... eventually instead of having multiple spots per section... make more sections

* Create a specialisation for an extra section X (tbd, not 1 or 2) slot. Or do this by skills of commercials? I'm fine with that new specialisation but based on skills it's chaotic for me, not stable and not realistic too

* Remove sponsor relations since it's not maintainable. To be replaced by a general sponsor happiness stat. There will be 3-5 type of sponsor stats, so that sponsors can fit into a certain type of company type. Ranging from Classy (Mercedes, McLaren, Ferrari), to youthful and rebellious (Red Bull, HAAS, ...). This will allow us to make more choices on how to position your team marketing wise, and will make that interesting in regards to which sponsors are interested. Moving from one type to the other will cost commercial points and will take some time.

I like the point system, needs to be tweaked better (cooldowns etc) but it kinda replicates the fact that in a single day you can't go throught the paddock and discull with ALL sponsors. Step by steps, keep those relations.

Are you trying to destroy that points system ? I don't like the fact you use points just to say "Hey, I'm a fun team, come RedBull" or "Hey I'm a serious team, come Classy sponsor"... Discipline of the team and other stats can already play that role and evolves over time

* Drivers get a marketability stat which is an extra influence into a certain company type that is mentioned above. Yeah but don't make it a driver-only stat... instead just do team's average caracter

* Sponsors will be more based on bonusses and not necessarily a fixed amount that is paid out. 100% OK with that, must-have

* A minimum requirement of certain objectives or the agreement is cancelled? If sponsor relation management is still about points don't do it, just stick to missed races

* Sponsors that go bankrupt or don't pay. Not against not for, we need to add some instability and Sponsors could even go in Shares market and it changes their "Financial wealth" somehow ?

* Remove fans price and replace by merchandise or something. To my mind fans should pay not once in a lifetime but on a week/season basis, but in that cases fans is not more a number that keeps growing but well depends on many factor such as performance and marketing thus fluctuating a lot

*I would like a script that shuffles the sponsor values - so the top sponsors get newly rated every x seasons and change based on the sector - e.g. the finance sector has a crisis and the sponsor activity is cut down, maybe even reduce the level from title sponsor to level 4 or lower - best with some text to make this changes appear less random.
this should be long term because it affects planning of finances. Yeah, just put sponsors in Shares market ya know

*ad drivers (or even staff) marketability: that one should be related to success in their career. And for example to their success in junior categories as well, as they'll create hype around them. And then it can all be combined into one "team marketability" stat depending on which drivers are assgined in the #1, #2 spot (and maybe additionally top designers, mechanics, but drivers would be fine for the beginning). And marketability should not only be determined by success. An obvious trait would be charisma to me, but also ambition and professionalism could play a part. yeah it should be common to the team, just an easy system, I don't like the fact to create exceptions you know like for "Driver#1 only" ; IFS doesn't look good in a program to me

*ad how to sign sponsors: I like the idea of reduced sponsors, but more importantly reduced slots. I want to send my commercials on a mission to a) improve relations (or whatever, just socialize, that should improve the future conditions/amount of sponsors they can find) OR b) look for a deal. Thats when the commercial gets sent away to talk to sponsors - and returns some time (f.e. a random range of 3 to 5 days) later with a message like "we've got an offer from sponsor A for our engine cover, they'd pay us 500k for 15 weeks. And we have sponsor B that offers 450k for 25 weeks.
You can then either sign that sponsor - or you can tell your commercial to search for better deals or you can tell your commercial to try to improve one of the deals - with the risk of the sponsor signing with another team or the commercial being too aggressive and the sponsor straight up cancelling negotiations. Either remove put only 1 spot per section (and more sections) or make things such as increase interest and things like that common to all sponsors in same section (but make it longer to increase as a downside). So even if we cancel negotiation, a backup is possible with others

*ad bankruptcy: yes, please. But with the chance of the teams cancelling the sponsor immediately. Logical if implemented


*I dont know if its possible, but: would it be possible to implement a certain sponsor balance (like for teams, but for sponsors) - and the sponsor itself gets simulated, maybe also to real life comapnies via stock market shares (of course just the real numbers that get updated every day, but no real company names). So if a reallife company does bad, the sponsor does bad and if its in the red it cant pay teams - or cancelles (for a fee) the sponsorship all by themselfes. Sponsors would need some income in return - that could be linked to the teams success, which connects to the next point: Yeah put it in PW Shares so that a manager can speculate on it too and make it feel for real than RNG

*min requirement: we already have the min races clause. thats a great start. additionally (when the commercial negotiates, see above) you can set some goals: a podium, a win, or 100 points this season or whatever. that can sweeten the deal, improve condition like income or length - but the sponsor has the right to cancel the contract without a fee if the goals are not met.
the connection to above: if the team raches the objectives, the sponsor will make money and thus not go bankrupt. (unless the stock market crashes ) I feel all this harsh, could be added later if new system works well

*remove fan prize - also yes. you should still be able to make some decisions like: cheap or expensive products, ect (maybe also linked with team image) - which attracts a certain kind of fanbase. Also, here I'd like a real fanbase that gets simulated. When a team joins they'll have a certain fanbase (100 people, idk) that buy stuff. once you get more successful, you can attract fans from other teams that will now buy stuff from your team instead of the other team. also, there should be a "global fans" stat that determines how many fans there are available globally - that can go up with exciting races (wet, different winners, close championship battles, close relegation battles (points and pace wise) and down (pure dominance of one driver, or one team). As a contest, let's all put 99M fee !

*While I'm at it: I'd like a small change on price money: add a TV revenue that gets determined for lets say 3 seasons. The price money is then based on TV revenue - fixed income for every team, no matter which position they finish in - 5 million - and some heavy success fee - so it makes sense for teams not to abandon development in week 2.
Maybe even base the success fee on points. 1 point = x money. Thus a DNF hurts. Or abandoning development hurts. Do we really need new sources of income, first we need more ways to spend money, now it only goes into driver's salary inflation wich is an issue. Besides, yeah you can argue div1 is more cost blablabla but its another way to add inequalities

*Please, more easy sponsors, 3 weeks and i don't have anything! Sponsors for rookies or another thing too. I suggest instant signed rookie deals for newcomers. For a season and not every section, just something to make the start a bit easier.
Make suppliers and sponsors easy first season, can be every section whatever

Do we really need new sources of income, first we need more ways to spend money, now it only goes into driver's salary inflation wich is an issue. Besides, yeah you can argue div1 is more cost blablabla but its another way to add inequalities

100% agreed and without taking over for Frank! LOL!! I was think since Frank has mentioned that he visioned Pitwall based off GP Manager I took majority of my ideas actually from that game model. One aspect that Pitwall is missing compared to the the GP Manager series is unlock-able facilities that help different section of the teams. I didn't post my ideas since this thread is about Sponsors but I can invasion us having to grow our teams more over a longer period time form higher level of Hq that gives ability to unlock different buildings with levels that can help or influence the different aspect of the team. I was also considering the traits aspect of the game where events during the season cause different traits positive or negitive for drivers and staff members a like. But in the end it will/should cost more money to build the team over a much longer time give managers a sense of progress and keeping managers around longer. I will make a separate post maybe.

Frank already has a strong basis here just needs to expanded the ideas; which I think he is already trying to do.

@Frank: Yes, It was a lot to processes as I wrote that post but you already have the basics already in place just need more fine tuning and adjustment to where you think/ like the game. At the end of the day it is your baby but I am sure most of the players will have great suggestion as to where to take the game so good and some not so good. Good luck filtering what matches your image for Pitwall.

All I can say is the more interactive you have the game means more likely players are to login as the need to interact with the game to be able to continue to progress. This is a double edge sword as too much interaction means managers find it too much work and leave but not enough means managers don't need to login so eventually leave. I think the game is too much to the second stage at the moment as I don't need to login Monday -Wednesday or Fridays since I can test on Thursday and Qualify on Saturdays. You will need to find a reason for teams to sign in Monday-Wednesdays if you want to keep them interested long term without making it a must to login daily.

I think you need to be carefull of how you bring in the changes as I bet that most of the div 1 teams and most of the long time playes think 2 to 3 seasons ahead and have planed to pay big for top staff and drivers as they have got good sponsors
like Robert pointed out about days that there is not much to do
I like the idea of going and trying to find hidden sponsors, maybe say Monday Tuesdays ( when I log on to replay the race that was run in my night time} you can send your commercial manager to find new sponsors also maybe send a driver along with your commercial manager to boost up that sponsor on Mondays Tuesdays